Sunday, December 01, 2013

Entrevista com Halim El-Dabh

"Através do eletromagnetismo eu posso estar em todo e qualquer lugar. Estou no topo das ondas sonoras e estou nas vibrações, tecendo a tapeçaria do tempo.

Fui recebido por trovões e relâmpagos quando eu nasci. Em seguida, aos 7 dias de vida, fui despertado por vozes humanas, instrumentos musicais e ruídos altos. Tudo isso refletia os momentos simples e os momentos complexos da criação."
Halim El-Dabh


Halim Abdul Messieh El-Dabh nasceu no dia 4 de março de 1921, em El-Sakakini, um bairro na cidade do Cairo, Egito. Desde muito cedo sua vida foi cheia de música. Os pais de Halim tocavam instrumentos musicais, bem como seus irmãos e suas irmãs, então foi natural que Halim se interessasse por música também. O piano da família foi sua primeira escolha (o irmão mais velho de Halim, Adeeb, era um pianista bem conhecido no Egito, naquela época). Em 1932, sua família mudou-se para Heliopolis (outro bairro na cidade do Cairo) e, no mesmo ano, o outro irmão de Halim, Bushra, levou-o para a Cairo Conference, organizada pelo Rei Fuad. Muitos músicos conhecidos, de várias partes do mundo, participaram da Cairo Conference e isto acabou agregando novas possibilidades aos horizontes musicais do jovem Halim.

Seguindo os passos de seu pai, que trabalhava com agricultura, Halim frequentou a Fuad I University (hoje chamada Cairo University), onde ele graduou-se em Engenharia Agrícola, em 1945. Naquela época a música de Halim já havia conquistado um certo público no Cairo, e ele também tinha expandido ainda mais seus conhecimentos e interesses musicais, então veio a idéia de misturar as duas áreas nas quais atuava, agricultura e música. Ele passou a estudar possibilidades de controlar e previnir, através de emissões sonoras, as pestes e insetos que atacavam as lavouras de trigo, milho, feijão e outras. Logo as pesquisas de Halim o levaram à Middle East Radio, uma pequena estação de rádio independente do Cairo, que possuia alguns gravadores e wire recorders. Como uma coisa leva à outra, em 1943 Halim começou a experimentar com os dispositivos de gravação e estúdios da rádio, alterando os sons que ele registrava. Em 1944, Halim resolveu gravar a cerimônia do Zaar (um ritual religioso feminino) e então, utilizando técnicas de estúdio e equipamentos eletrônicos, ele modificou e tratou as gravações que fez durante a cerimônia e voilà, surgia a primeira peça gravada com manipulação de fita que se tem noticia, do mundo todo! (Notem que isto aconteceu 4 anos antes de Pierre Schaeffer publicar seus primeiros trabalhos com musique concrète, na França). The Expression Of The Zaar foi a única peça publicada por Halim neste período, embora ele tenha criado várias outras peças utilizando manipulação de fita, a maior parte com gravações de vendedores de rua do Cairo.

Em 1949, Halim El-Dabh foi convidado para realizar um concerto na All Saints Cathedral, no Cairo, e depois de uma performance muito aplaudida, ele foi convidado por um oficial da Embaixada Americana no Egito para estudar nos Estados Unidos da América. No ano seguinte, 1950, Halim mudou-se para os Estados Unidos, com uma bolsa de estudos. Nos Estados Unidos ele estudou composição com alguns dos maiores nomes da música acadêmica da época: John Donald Robb e Ernst Krenek (na University of New Mexico), Francis Judd Cooke (no New England Conservatory of Music), Aaron Copland e Luigi Dallapiccola (no Berkshire Music Center), e Irving Fine (na Brandeis University). Mais tarde, Halim mudou-se para New Jersey e passou a fazer parte da cena musical de New York dos anos 50. Na métade da década, Halim foi convidado para um período na MacDowell Colony e lá ele escreveu sua peça Symphonies In Sonic Vibrations. Foi justamente esta peça - e principalmente a maneira como Halim El-Dabh explorava os sons do piano na MacDowell Colony - que chamaram a atenção de dois dos maiores nomes da música eletrônica da época: Otto Luening e Vladimir Ussachevsky. Mais do que sentirem-se atraídos pela música maravilhosa de Halim, os dois ficaram sabendo que Halim El-Dabh estava trabalhando com música eletrônica por mais de 10 anos (desde 1943). O professor Luening e o professor Ussachevsky (juntamente com os professores Roger Sessions e Milton Babbitt) fundaram o famoso Columbia-Princeton Electronic Music Center e, depois de Halim concluir seu período na MacDowell Colony, eles o convidaram para trabalhar no estúdio de música eletrônica. Logo, Halim começou a compor suas pecas eletrônicas no estúdio (a obra de 1959, Leiyla And The Poet, é um dos trabalhos mais famosos de Halim, neste período). Ele também colaborou com Otto Luening nas composições Diffusion Of The Bells e Electronic Fanfarre, ambas criadas em 1962. Para resumir, Halim não foi somente o primeiro homem a lançar uma peça com manipulação de fita neste mundo, em 1944. Ele também estava lá, presente e atuante, como uma das poucas pessoas que ajudaram a forjar os dias de ouro da música eletrônica nos anos 50!

As raízes nômades de Halim El-Dabh o inspiraram a viajar o mundo todo, durante toda sua vida, para pesquisar e gravar música e pessoas de várias nações (incluindo uma viagem ao Brazil, em 1982). Além disso, Halim lecionou em diversas instituições de ensino, incluindo a Haile Selassie I University (hoje em dia chamada Addis Ababa University, em Addis Ababa, Etiopia), Howard University (em Washington D.C., Estados Unidos, entre 1966 e 1969) e Kent State University (em Kent, Ohio, entre 1969 e 1991). Halim vive em Kent, Ohio, desde o final dos anos 60, com sua atual esposa e manager Deborah El-Dabh.

Entrei em contato com Halim via email para fazer esta entrevista, há algumas semanas. Na verdade, entrei em contato com sua adorável esposa - também responsável por gerenciar sua carreira - Deborah El-Dabh, que gentilmente respondeu a todos os emails que eu escrevi. Enviei as questões, então Halim gravou as respostas em vídeo e outra adorável pessoa, a professora Laurel Myers Hurst, gentilmente conduziu a entrevista e transcreveu as palavras de Halim do vídeo para texto. Serei eternamente grato a estas duas senhoras, Deborah e Laurel, por me permitirem chegar um pouquinho mais perto desta figura rara que é Halim El-Dabh!  Existe uma canção do Elton John, chamada "Your Song", na qual ele canta "como é maravilhosa a vida com sua presença neste mundo". Bom, isto traduz meu sentimento com esta oportunidade de contatar Halim, Deborah e Laurel: que maravilhosa é a chance que tenho de dividir com eles este mundo grande e doido, cheio de música e cheio de vida! Obrigado Halim, Deborah e Laurel!
Foto: James Vaughan
Entrevista com Halim El-Dabh realizada no dia 17 de outubro de 2013, transcrita por Laurel Myers Hurst:

1 - Como foi seu primeiro contato com a música e quais são as suas memórias musicais mais antigas?

HALIM EL-DABH - No dia em que eu nasci estava acontecendo uma tempestade como nunca havia acontecido antes. Minha mãe me disse que haviam raios e trovões, granizo e neve ao mesmo tempo, coisas que não eram características da estação do ano em que estávamos. Tudo foi derrubado pela tempestade. Os trovões foram minha primeira exposição ao som.
No meu sétimo dia de vida, na minha cerimônia de escolha do nome, o subuh, toda a comunidade e os músicos vieram e formaram um círculo ao meu redor. Eles me colocaram em uma peneira, daquelas utilizadas para separar o joio do trigo. Enquanto eu ouvia os sons da música ao meu redor, toda a negatividade era tirada do meu corpo, me expondo a um mundo novo. A força da comunidade cantando me esclareceu sobre tudo que estaria por vir. Todas aquelas pessoas cantaram, caminharam e dançaram em volta de mim sete vezes quando eu tinha apenas sete dias de vida. Esta foi minha primeira exposição à música de verdade.
Como eu era o caçula de nove filhos, meus pais e meus irmãos e irmãs fizeram experiências comigo, me enviando para várias escolas diferentes. Eles queriam que eu tivesse uma boa iniciação, então a partir dos três anos de idade eu frequentei uma escola jesuíta. Lá eu aprendi várias canções francesas. Lembro de várias, até hoje. Uma que vem à cabeça imediatamente é sobre um barquinho no mar querendo viajar, mas que não podia navegar. Ele não conseguia se mover. Minha educação foi muito ampla e incluía tanto os conhecimentos aprendidos em casa quanto os aprendidos em uma escola onde se falava árabe.
Em casa nós tínhamos um piano, alaúdes, violinos e tambores. Meu irmão Adeeb tocava piano. Adeeb também tocava violino. Bushra tocava violino e um alaúde egípcio, e meus primos tocavam alaúde. Alguns de nós tocavamos alaúdes como se fossem violões. Eramos vários músicos. Meu pai cantava, ele sempre gostou de cantar. Minha mãe tocava um instrumento similar a um acordeon, porém sem as teclas. É um instrumento antigo. Este instrumento tem relação com o orgão hidráulico, o hydraulos.
Naquela época, eu ainda não tinha aulas formais de piano. Quando eu era criança, imitava meu irmão tocando piano. Ele se tornou um pianista muito conhecido no rádio. Naquela época haviam várias estações de rádio pequenas e independentes. Ele sempre improvisava e tocava tudo o que ouvia, e então apresentava suas peças no rádio e para outros públicos. Ele tocava com os filmes mudos, às vezes. Então ele era uma inspiração para mim e eu tentava seguir seus passos. O piano era muito atraente para mim, e alguns tambores também me chamavam a atenção. Eu não cheguei a tocar violino, mas aprendi a tocar piano e a compor no piano.
Conforme minhas habilidades ao piano iam melhorando, eu fui conquistando público, fazendo o que eu fazia. Provavelmente foi um incentivo para mim ter um público. Qualquer coisa que eu fizesse, haviam pessoas interessadas em ouvir.
Meu irmão mais velho, Bushra, reconheceu minha musicalidade naturalmente, Adeeb estava envolvido com seus estudos e sua técnica ao piano. Então o Michael, outro irmão meu, levava-me para improvisar ao piano, enquanto ele praticava patinação artística. Ele adorava patinar e sempre que fazia isso, me dizia: "Toque algo enquanto eu me movimento!" Então eu constumava pensar em coisas vivas e  alegres. Era muito imediato e espontâneo. Michael me colocava sentando e dizia: "Aqui está o piano e ali estão os tambores. E eu vou patinar!" Na verdade, ele me colocou na ativa, me expôs ao mundo.
Bushra sempre quis que eu frequentasse um conservatório de música, o que acabei fazendo quando tinha 15 ou 16 anos de idade. Mas aos 11 anos de idade eu fazia as coisas por minha conta mesmo, escrevia, lutava para descobrir as notas e escrever música por conta própria. É incrível, não?
Aos 11 anos de idade eu comecei a escrever música em reflexo à minha visita à grande Conferência do Cairo de 1932. Eu já escrevia antes de ir à conferência, é claro, então meu irmão Bushra me levou até o encontro organizado pelo Rei Fuad. O rei convidou músicos muito conhecidos, de várias partes do mundo, a virem ao Cairo: Béla Bartok, Hindemith (que estava encarregado das sessões de gravação), Jaap Knust (que estava encarregado do embasamento teórico do encontro), Henry Farmer e Rodolphe d'Erlanger. D'Erlanger escreveu uma obra em seis volumes sobre a música árabe e foi considerado o primeiro europeu a tornar-se perito em música árabe.

2 - E sobre a música eletrônica, você lembra qual foi seu primeiro contato com equipamentos eletrônicos?

HALIM EL-DABH - Meu primeiro contato com equipamentos de som eletrônicos foi em 1943. Como eu era um engenheiro agrônomo e estava estudando o controle de pestes, queria ver se os dispositivos de emissão sonora poderiam controlar pequenos besouros que atacavam o trigo, o milho, a alfafa e os feijões. Eu achava que poderíamos desorientar os besouros ao invés de nos livrarmos deles. Eu costumava fazer experiências com barras de ferro, batendo-as como se fossem sinos e depois eu experimentei esfregar uma barra na outra, para ver se isto desencorajava os insetos. Mais ou menos ao mesmo tempo, eu estava usando espelhos e sons para evitar que as abelhas voassem para longe das suas colméias. Quando as abelhas estavam tentando deixar suas colônias, os espelhos refletiam a luz do sol sobre elas, fazendo com que voltassem para suas colméias ao invés de emigrarem. Você não quer sua colônia emigrando. Você quer mante-la no mesmo lugar.
Então veio meu contato com a Middle East Radio, no Cairo, uma pequena estação independente. A estação era rica, possuía uma variedade grande de equipamentos de som e gravadores diferentes. Depois da Conferência do Cairo, houve uma grande conscientização sobre gravação de som. Os músicos locais passaram a ter um desejo muito forte de gravar músicas, então várias empresas no Cairo começaram a importar uma variedade de gravadores. Eu lembro dos gravadores Marconi (da Itália), Poussant (da Dinamarca) e Telefunken (da Alemanha). A Middle East Radio tinha também um wire recorder, disponível para experiências sonoras. Eu costumava fazer manipulações eletrônicas e físicas do som e também do estúdio, nas gravações que criava. Eu podia ajustar o som emitido originalmente, filtrando vários harmônicos de uma nota ou até mesmo eliminar completamente a nota fundamental. Eu podia aplicar voltagem controlada à nota, para mudar suas características e assim criar vários pulsos rítmicos. Eu podia até mesmo mudar as características físicas do estúdio de gravação, mudando de lugar paredes móveis dentro do estúdio, e assim alterar sutilmente as quantidades de reverber e eco, conforme mais me agradasse. E então eu gravava os resultados no wire recorder. Todos estes recursos estavam disponíveis na estação de rádio.

3 - Em 1944 você gravou "The Expression Of The Zaar", a primeira peça a utilizar manipulação de fita. Como esta peça foi gravada e manipulada?

HALIM EL-DABH - Eu estava interessado em como o som se relacionava com várias coisas. Começou com aqueles pequenos insetos, mas eu também passei a me interessar na relação do som com a cura, especialmente com as cerimônias de cura da sociedade feminina chamada ZaarThe Expression of The Zaar foi gravado em um wire recorder. O wire recorder era parecido com os outros gravadores, porém a mídia utilizada tinha a espessura de um fio de cabelo e era enrolada nas bobinas. Eu gravei as vozes das mulheres do Zaar no wire recorder e então passei por dispositivos de reverberação, voltagem controlada e eco. Eu separei os tons fundamentais das vozes como um método para manipular o conteúdo. Eu fiz experiências com o som das vozes e então eliminei o tom fundamental. De repente, sem o tom fundamental, eu descobri uma expressão completamente diferente do som que eu havia registrado originalmente, eliminando parte dos seus componentes. Foi assim que eu criei The Expression Of The Zaar. Sobrepondo harmônicos, eu conseguia resultados diferentes. Eu criei uma porção de músicas diferentes naquela época, mas a única publicada foi Ta'abir al-Zaar. Eu deveria procurar pelas outras. The Expression Of The Zaar foi salva porque eu continuei a trabalhar com ela, regravando-a antes que desaparecesse.

4 - Como era sua vida antes de você se mudar para os Estados Unidos da América, no início dos anos 50?

HALIM EL-DABH - Meu irmão Bushra tinha um piano de cauda e sua casa ficava perto da nossa. Quando ele viajava, dizia: "Fique na minha casa." No segundo andar, sua casa ficava aberta para todas as casas da vizinhança em volta. Quando eu abria as portas da varanda dos fundos, as varandas das outras casas ficavam dispostas para mim como se fosse uma grande arena, com todas as famílias esperando ansiosamente nos seus camarotes. Então ele deixava eu tocar aquele piano todas as noites, às duas da manhã. Eu tinha esta enorme platéia nos fundos de casa, esperando eu começar a tocar o piano e, naturalmente, eu fazia todos os tipos de sons no instrumento. Fazia clusters no piano e o dedilhava. Eu tinha aprovação, público e apreciação. Aquilo me mantinha tocando.
A noticia se espalhou e eu passei a ser convidado por instituições para falar sobre minha música. Eu fazia parte de pequenos conjuntos quando cursava o ensino fundamental e o ensino médio. E na universidade, também montamos um pequeno conjunto. As obras que tocávamos na escola eram standards normais de repertório. Somado a isso, eu tive numerosas aventuras musicais fora da escola. Eu improvisava bastante com meu irmão. Eu tinha cinco irmãos e três irmãs. Minhas irmãs tocavam também. Minha vida era realmente cheia de música. E tínhamos grupos que se encontravam para ouvir música contemporânea. Conheci a peça Pierrot Lunaire e ouvia Schoenberg aos 14 anos de idade. Era muito excitante! Minha mãe ficava louca com aquilo e me perguntava: "O que está acontecendo aqui?", eu dizia: "Ouça isso! Pierrot Lunaire!" Pierrot Lunaire me deixava louco. E eu também ouvia Rite Of Spring, do Stravinsky.
Eu comecei a me envolver com pessoas com interesses internacionais. Eu vivia em Heliopolis, subúrbio do Cairo. Nos reuníamos várias vezes para experiências com música e trocar idéias na YMCA. A YMCA era um centro cultural para concertos, filosofia, idéias diferentes, encontros, para tudo. Fiz várias experiências com música lá. Toquei algumas das minhas composições em exposições de arte na YMCA e em outras instituições cultuais. Eles tinham uma sala para mim, no estúdio de arte. As pessoas passavam e ouviam minha música como parte da exposição. Eles fizeram isso com The Expression Of The Zaar e com It Is Dark And Damp On The Front. Qualquer música que eu fizesse, eles a exibiam. Então eu tive muito reconhecimento e apoio quando estava crescendo.
Eu passei a ter aulas formais aos 15 anos de idade e continuei estudando no Schulz Conservatory. Eu me envolvi com outros conservatórios também, como o Tiegerman Conservatory e o Hickmann Conservatory. O Hickmann era interessado no Egito antigo, então eu constumava frequentar seu conservatório. Hickmann estava tentando comparar o clarinete com um antigo instrumento de palheta. Ele achava que o clarinete tinha suas origens no Egito e então ele trouxe alguns exemplos de clarinete e bassoon para o conservatório. Era muito interessante.
Eu também frequentei o Institute of Arabic Music, no Cairo, um instituto enorme. Eles tinham um piano com escala de 24 tons. Na verdade eu toquei um instrumento destes em uma das minhas composições nas Nações Unidas. Foi realizado com uma mulher síria, que havia criado um piano como aquele do Cairo, com 24 notas por oitava e teclado duplo.
Eu experimentei com piano, tambores, com vozes. Minha voz e outras vozes. Principalmente experiências com vozes. A voz sempre me atraiu muito. 

5 - Como foi trabalhar no famoso Columbia-Princeton Electronic Music Center, nos anos 50, e como foi trabalhar com Otto Luening e Vladimir Ussachevsky?

HALIM EL-DABH - A história começa em 1955, 56. Eu fui convidado para a MacDowell Colony em Petersboro, New Hampshire. Eu tinha uma cabana lá, com um piano. A MacDowell Colony trazia compositores e artistas para o local, deixando-os a sós e em paz, e providenciava tudo o que eles precisavam. Durante o tempo em que fiquei lá a biblioteca tinha um piano de cauda, então eu cotumava ir lá, trancava a porta e mudava tudo. Eu pegava fios, os conectava às cordas do piano, amarrava-os e os prendia na parede. Eu queria conseguir uma variedade maior de sons das cordas, então escrevi a peça Symphonies In Sonic Vibrations durante este período. E um belo dia, quem entrou nesta biblioteca transformada por mim? Ambos, Luening e Ussachevsky. Eles olharam bem e perguntaram supresos: "O que você está fazendo aqui?" No momento em que viram o que eu estava fazendo, comentaram: "Este cara deveria vir à Columbia University conosco."
Depois de concluir a MacDowell Colony, fui convidado a ir à Columbia University com uma bolsa de estudos, para utilizar seu estúdio e trabalhar lá. Com o passar dos anos, Leuning e eu colaboramos em diversas composições, como Electronic Fanfarre e Diffusion Of Bells. Colaboramos utilizando o maquinário e o gravador eletrônico RCA que havia lá. Primeiramente eu fui como convidado e, em seguida, me tornei membro do Columbia-Princeton Electronic Music Center. Então, depois daquela visita onde eles viram o que eu estava fazendo, me arrastaram para a Columbia University. Eles viram como eu estava lidando com o som e com as vibrações sonoras.

6 - Você pode nos contar mais um pouco sobre o RCA Sound Synthesizer?

HALIM EL-DABH - O sintetizador foi uma inovação que expandiu as possibilidades que tínhamos de manipulação sonora. Utilizavamos cartões perfurados para o som entrar e sair da máquina. Ocupava uma parede inteira, era enorme. Eramos capazes de conseguir muito claros de qualquer coisa que sintetizassemos, fosse este um trumpete, um violino ou qualquer outro som. Particularmente, eu gostava de manipular minha voz. Luening passou sua flauta piccolo pelo sintetizador, para modificá-la. Eu passei meus tambores, para modificar, e então enviei os sons de volta para o sintetizador. Os membros do Music Center fizeram um pacto para não imitarem or recriarem os instrumentos originais, já que compreendíamos que aqueles sons poderiam tirar os empregos de quem fazia música ao vivo.
O sintetizador tem a ver com manipulação matemática dos sons. Babbitt era bem mais envolvido com ele, por conta dos seus pensamentos serem mais matemáticos. Babbitt era quem mais gostava de trabalhar com o sintetizador, mas eu trabalhei com ele, principalmente pegando sons e manipulando-os posteriormente, através de uma série de gravadores Ampex que havia no estúdio. Com dez máquinas Ampex, seus controles remotos e torres de alto-falantes nos corredores fora da sala, eu passava as fitas pelos gravadores Ampex e então pelos corredores, em loop. Eu tinha um grande número de loops e, enquanto eles tocavam, eu gravava o que eu queria deles. Era algo! Eu tinha loops por todo o corredor, espalhando-se na minha frente e então voltando na minha direção. Com os controles remotos e todos aqueles loops, eu dançava! Era fabuloso! Eu dizia "Wow!"
Aqueles loops íam e vínham e eu acabei gravando o resultado. Peguei então a gravação disto tudo e coloquei para tocar novamente. Eu chamava o processo de "geração", porque a primeira geração era meio que bruta, crua. Quando você trabalha com isso, tem que lidar com geração após geração. Eu pedurava as fitas de uma geração na parede, daí eu juntava elas em grupos de várias gerações até que a parede toda estivesse coberta de gerações de fitas. Então eu podia ir até a parede e pegar algumas que eu quisesse e mixá-las novamente. Quando chegava em quatro ou cinco gerações interagindo, eu começava a me sentir confortável. Na primeira geração, você podia ouvir o som do instrumento cru; no final, você tinha que ir a fundo no som. Você realmente tinha que ir nas profundezas dele.
Eu tive a felicidade de ser convidado pelo trombonista George Lewis para visitar a velha sala com os gravadores Ampex, mais ou menos em 2005. Depois de trabalhar com as máquinas Ampex, o Columbia-Princeton Electronic Music Center passou a ter sintetizadores Moog, mas eu nunca os utilizei.  Eu utilizei o sintetizador RCA por algum tempo, mas nunca sem manipular extensivamente o som final. Basicamente eu confiava nos meus processos de filtrar e alterar as gravações, especialmente com alterações de voltagem. Eu também fiz muita coisa utilizando ruído branco. O ruído branco permite grandes possibilidades, porque tudo está dentro dele. 

7 - Você viajou ao Brazil nos anos 70 e no início dos anos 80, certo? Quais são as suas lembranças destas viagens?

HALIM EL-DABH - Eu tinha planos de ir ao Brazil nos anos 70, mas na verdade eu viajei à Salvador, Bahia, em 1982, 83. Eu fui lá para pesquisar algumas músicas Afro-Brazileiras, e então eu acabei me envolvendo com a cerimônia do candomblé. Eu conheci muitas pessoas e pude participar de vários rituais de candomblé. Alguns rituais eram em reverência a Ogun e, nas montanhas de Petrópolis, eram para Exu. Na Bahia eram para Shango. Em um dos terreiros, o local sagrado, havia um Preto Velho sentando, para conversar. O Preto Velho é um velho e sábio negro. Eles me chamavam de Shango Kao. Eu não sei direito o que significa Kao. talvez as pessoas estivessem me chamando de Shango do Oriente, pois eu tinha sido atingido por um raio e Shango é o deus que supostamente faz isso.
Foi um período muito bom e eu visitei a ilha de Itaparica, onde eu fui testemunha da cerimônia dos Egunguns. Foi uma experiência incrível.
Basicamente, passei todo o tempo na Bahia, Petropolis, Itaparica e no Rio de Janeiro, onde toquei música com algumas pessoas. Toquei com o percussionista Djalma Correa. Toquei na Sala Cecília Meireles com ele e com outros músicos do Rio, com a casa lotada. Eu toquei piano e eles tocaram percussão e clarinete. Foi uma ótima experiência. Não dormi nem um pouco durante o carnaval. Eu assisti a todos os eventos e viajei do Rio de Janeiro para a Bahia, para ver o carnaval lá. Tive uma experiência rica e completa com a cultura Afro-Brazileira, as cerimônias e a música. Participei ativamente da parte musical do Brazil enquanto estive aí. Tive uma recepção generosa e amável por parte das pessoas que pude conheçer. Fizeram com que tudo fosse maravilhoso para que eu pudesse continuar com minhas pesquisas. Tive contato com um parlamentar chamado Nascimento e sua esposa norte-americana. Ele fazia parte da tradição que eu estava estudando. Também tive contato com a Universidade do Brazil, em Salvador. Lá eu falei sobre a retenção da cultura iorubá no Brazil e sua relação com a cultura egípcia. Tive bastante envolvimento com os estudantes na universidade do Rio de Janeiro, então vivi muito ativamente enquanto estava no Brazil.

8 - O que você tem feito hoje em dia e quais os seus planos para o futuro?

HALIM EL-DABH - Me sinto energizado por conta deste entusiasmo em torno da música eletrônica. Tendo feito música eletrônica nos primórdios, com Ta'abir al-Zaar, eu ainda continuo à procura de novas maneiras de transformar os sons e de utilizar a música eletrônica. Em 2001 eu completei um trabalho chamado Signals And Connections, para o American Music Center, em New York. É uma peça doida. Você ouve ela no telefone, quando liga para o American Music Center.
Neste exato momento eu quero explorar mais os sons da voz humana. Eu sempre tive interesse no alcance e no poder da voz humana, os elementos contidos nela são realmente infinitos. Ainda tenho interesse na voz e em como sua transformação nos afeta, como um trabalho criativo e uma forma de arte. Estou me recuperando, para ter meu equipamento em forma novamente.
Todos os sons me fascinam, dos sons das cigarras e besouros aos sons do dia a dia. Mais do que nunca, quero trabalhar com sons humanos, naturais e de tudo ao meu redor, para comunicar e dividir com o mundo.

Foto: James Vaughan
Foto: Christo

Atualização: Halim El-Dabh, Deborah El-Dabh e Astronauta Pinguim em Kent, OH (USA), no dia 28 de julho de 2014 (foto de Laurel Myers Hurst):



Site oficial de Halim El-Dabh: www.halimeldabh.com

Interview with Halim El-Dabh

"With the electric magnetic I feel that I am everywhere. I am with the creases of sound waves. And of vibrations riding the tapestry of time.

I was embraced by thunder and lightening at birth. Then at age of 7 days I was awakened by human voices mixed with musical instruments and loud noises. All reflect simple and complex moments of creation."
Halim El-Dabh


Halim Abdul Messieh El-Dabh was born on March 4th 1921, in El-Sakakini, a district in Cairo, Egypt. Since he was young, his life was full of music. Halim's parents, brothers and sisters all played musical instruments, so it was natural that he became interested in music also. The piano that the family owned was his first choice. Halim's brother Adeeb was a very well-known musician in Egypt in those days. His family moved to Heliopolis (another district of Cairo) in 1932, the same year that Bushra, another of Halim's brothers, took young Halim to the Cairo Conference, organized by King Fuad. Many very well known musicians, from different parts of the world, attended the Cairo Conference which in turn added new possibilities to Halim's musical horizons.

Following the steps of his father, who worked in agiculture, Halim attended the Fuad I University (now Cairo University), where he graduated with a degree in Agricultural Engineering in 1945. At that time Halim's music already had an audience in Cairo. He had increased his music knowledge and interests, so he conceived the idea of mixing both things, agriculture and music. He began to study on possibilities of controlling and preventing bugs and pests from attacking wheat, corn, beans, etc. through sound. Soon Halim's research lead him to the Middle East Radio, a small independent radio station in Cairo, which had recording machines and wire recorders. As one thing leads to the other, in 1943 Halim began to experiment with those recording devices and the radio station studios, altering the sounds that he recorded. In 1944 Halim decided to record the ceremony of the Zaar (a female religious ceremony), he then treated the recordings he made on the ceremony using studio techniques and electronic devices and voilà, the first piece of tape manipulation that we know of, in the world, was born! (Note that it happened four years before Pierre Schaeffer released his first published works in France). The Expression Of The Zaar was Halim's only piece to be published from this period, but he created another pieces of tape manipulation mostly of street vendors in Cairo.

In 1949, Halim El-Dabh was invited to perform at All Saints Cathedral in Cairo, and after a well received concert he was invited by an official of the USA embassy in Egypt to study in the USA. In the next year, 1950, Halim moved to USA on a Fulbright Fellowship. In USA Halim studied composition with some of the greatest names in music of that time: John Donald Robb and Ernst Krenek (at the University of New Mexico), Francis Judd Cooke (at the New England Conservatory of Music), Aaron Copland and Luigi Dallapiccola (at the Berkshire Music Center), and Irving Fine (at Brandeis University). Later on, Halim moved to New Jersey and became part of the NY music scene of the '50s. In the middle of the '50s, Halim was invited to MacDowell Colony for a period os time, in which he wrote his piece Symphnies In Sonic Vibrations. It was this piece and mainly the way that Halim El-Dabh explored the sounds of the piano at MacDowell Colony which attracted the attention of two of the greatest names of electronic music of that time: Otto Luening and Vladimir Ussachevsky. More than being attracted by Halim's wonderful music, both became acquainted with the fact that Halim El-Dabh was working in the electronic music field for more than ten years prior (since 1943). Professor Luening and professor Ussachevsky (along with professors Roger Sessions and Milton Babbit) founded the famous Columbia-Princeton Electronic Music Center and after Halim finished his MacDowell Colony period, they invited him to work at the electronic music studio. Soon Halim began to create his electronic music pieces at the studio. His 1959 piece Leiyla And The Poet is one of Halim's most famous piece from that time. Halim also collaborated with Otto Luening on the works Diffusion Of The Bells and Electronic Fanfarre (both 1962). To translate in a few words, Halim wasn't only the first person to release a tape manipulation recording in 1944. He is also one of a few people who helped to create the golden days of electronic music in the '50s!

Halim El-Dabh's nomad roots inspired him to travel the world during his lifetime, to research and record music and people from various nations (including a trip to Brazil, in 1982). Aside from that, Halim taught at a number of educational institutions, including Haile Selassie I University (now Addis Ababa University, in Addis Ababa, Ethiopia), Howard University (in Washington D.C., USA, from 1966 to 1969) and Kent State University (in Kent, Ohio, from 1969 to 1991). Halim has lived in Kent, Ohio, since the late '60s, where he continues to reside with his present wife Deborah El-Dabh.

I've contacted Halim to do this interview via email, a few weeks ago. In fact, I've contacted his lovely wife and music manager, Deborah, who was very gentle in replying to every email that I wrote. I've sent the questions and Halim recorded in video the answers and then a lovely professor, Laurel Myers Hurst, gently conducted the interview and made the transcription of Halim words from video to text. I will be always grateful to those two people, Deborah and Laurel, for making it possible for me to become a little bit closer to this great man, Halim El-Dabh! There's a song by Elton John, called "Your Song", in which he sings "how wonderful life is while you're in the world". Well, that's my feeling in having this opportunity to contact Halim, Deborah and Laurel: how wonderful is to have the chance to share with you this big and crazy world, full of music and full of life! Thanks Halim, Deborah and Laurel!

Photo: James Vaughan
Interview with Halim El-Dabh, as told to Laurel Myers Hurst:

1- What are your earliest musical memories and how was your first contact with music?

HALIM EL-DABH - The day I was born there were storms like never before. My mother told me there was thunder and lightning, hail and snow that were totally uncharacteristic for the season. It was all brought down with the thunder. Thundering is my first exposure to sound.
At my seventh day naming ceremony, subuh, all the community and musicians came and circled around me. They put me on a strainer, the kind of sieve that separates wheat from chaff. As I listened to the sound of music around me, all the negativity was strained away from my body exposing me to the new world. The force of the community singing clarified me for whatever was to come. All the people sang, walked around and danced seven times they walked around me when I was only seven days old. That was my earliest exposure to real music.
As the youngest of nine children, my parents and even my brothers and sisters experimented with me by sending me to different schools. They wanted me to get off to a good start, so from three years old I went to Jesuit school. There I learned many French songs. I remember many of them to this day. The one that comes to mind immediately is about a little ship on the sea that wanted to travel, but he couldn't navigate. He couldn't get moving. My education was very broad, and included wisdom learned at home and at Arabic-speaking school.
At home we had a piano, lutes, violins and drums. My brother Adeeb played piano. Adeeb also played some violin. Bushra played violin and an Egyptian lute, and my cousins played lute. Some of us played guitar-like lutes. We had a lot of musicians. My father sang, he always liked to sing. My mother played an instrument similar to the accordion that had no keys. It's an old instrument. That instrument is related to the ancient water organ, the hydraulos.
At that age, I wasn't taking formal piano lessons. As a child, when I played piano I was imitating my brother. He became a very well-known pianist on the radio. In that day we had many small, independent radio stations. He always improvised and played anything he heard and then performed the pieces for the radio and other audiences. He played with the silent movies sometimes. So he was an inspiration to me, and I tried to follow after him. The piano was very attractive to me, and some of the drums caught me attention, too. I didn't get to play the violin, but I got to play the piano and compose on the piano.
As my piano skills improved, I had a lot of audiences whenever I did what I did. That was probably an encouragement to me, having an audience. Whatever I did people wanted to hear.
My older brother, Bushra, recognized my musicianship. Of course Adeeb was involved in his piano technique. Then Michael, another brother, dragged me to improvise for his figure skating. He loved to figure skate and whenever he went to skate he would say forcefully, "Play something while I'm moving!" So I used to think of things to make it alive. It was very immediate and spontaneous. Michael would sit me down and say, "Here's a piano and there are drums, I'm going to skate and do figures!" He actually put me into action, exposed me to the world.
Bushra always wanted me to go to a conservatory, which eventually I did by the time I was 15 or 16. At eleven years old I was on my own, writing, struggling to know the notes and write music down on my own. It's amazing, isn't it?
I started at age eleven to write some music in reflection on my visit to the big Cairo Conference of 1932. I was writing, of course, before the conference, so my brother, Bushra, took me to the meeting organized by King Fuad. The king invited very well known musicians from all over the world to Cairo: Béla Bartok, Hindemith (who was in charge of the recording sessions), Jaap Knust (who was in charge of the theoretical basis of the meeting), Henry Farmer and Rodolphe d'Erlanger. D'Erlanger wrote a six volume work on Arabic music and was considered one of the first European experts on Arabic music.

2 - About electronic music, what first exposure to electronic devices you remember?

HALIM EL-DABH - My first exposure to electronic sound devices was back in 1943. As an agriculturist studying pest control, I wanted to see if sound-emitting devices could control tiny beetles that attack wheat, corn, alfalfa and beans. I thought that rather than getting rid of the beetles, we could distract them. I used to experiment with clanging together iron rods like bells; then I tried scratching the rods together to see if it discouraged the bugs. About the same time, I was using mirrors and sound to keep bees from flying away from their hives. When the bees tried to leave their colony, the mirrors pushed sunlight on them and they went back to their hives rather than emigrating. You don't want your colony emigrating. You want to keep it in.
Then came my contact with Middle East Radio in Cairo, a small independent station. The station was rich with a number of different sound devices and recording machines. After the Cairo Conference, there was a great consciousness about sound recording. Local musicians had a strong desire to record music, so there were a lot of companies in Cairo that imported a variety of machines. I recall Marconi from Italy, Poussant from Denmark and Telefunken from Germany. Middle East Radio also had a wire recorder available for sound experiments. I used electronic and physical manipulation of the sound and the studio to create various wire recordings. I could tune the sound-emitting devices to filter out various harmonics in a tone or to eradicate the fundamental tone. I could apply voltage control to the tone to change it's quality and create various rhythmic pulses. I even changed the physical qualities of the recording studios by moving panel walls within the studio, altering the subtleties of echo and reverberation to suit me. Then I recorded the resulting sounds on the wire recorder. All these capabilities were available around the radio station.

3 - In 1944 you recorded "The Expression Of The Zaar", the first tape manipulation piece. How was it recorded and manipulated?

HALIM  EL-DABH - I was interested in how sound related to many things. It started with those little teeny bugs, but I also became interested in sound and healing, especially the healing ceremony of the society of women called Zaar. The Expression Of The Zaar was recorded on a wire. The wire recorder looked like the other recorders, but the recording medium was hair-thin and spooled around the reels. I recorded the input of the Zaar women's voices, and then played back through the devices of reverberation, voltage control and echo. I separated the fundamental tones of the voices as a method of manipulating the content; I experimented with what happened to the sound of the voice when I took the fundamental sound out. Suddenly, without the fundamental tone, I found an entirely expression of the sound, I exposed a different sound by eliminating parts of the components. This is how I created The Expression Of The Zaar. By overlapping the overtones, I got different resulting sounds. I created a lot of different musics at that time, but only one to be published was Ta'abir al-Zaar. I should dig out the other ones. The Expression Of The Zaar was saved because I continued with it and rerecorded it before it disappeared.

4 - How was your life before you moved to the USA in the early 1950s?

HALIM EL-DABH - My brother Bushra had a baby grand piano, and his house was near our house. When he traveled, he said, "You go to my house". On the second floor, his house opened up to all the neighbors' houses in back of them. When I opened his rear balcony doors the balconies of the other homes were arrayed about me like a vast arena, with every family waiting expectantly in their boxes. So he left that piano for me and at 2:00 AM every night I started playing. I had this huge audience in the back of the house waiting for me to play the piano, and of course I did all sorts of sounds on the piano. I did clusters on the piano and strummed it. I had approval, and audience and appreciation. That kept me playing.
The word traveled around, and I was invited to institutions to talk about my music. I was part of elementary and high school small ensembles, then at the university we also organized a small ensemble. The works we played in school were standards of the repertoire. Added to that, I had numerous exploratory adventures in music outside of school. I improvised a lot for my brother. I have five brothers and three sisters. My sisters played, too. My life was really full of music. Then we had groups that got together to listen to contemporary music. I was exposed to Pierrot Lunaire, and I was listening to Schoenberg at age of 14. I was so excited. My mother was sort of crazy with it, asking, "What's going on?" I said, "Look at this sound! Pierrot Lunaire!" Pierrot Lunaire drove me crazy, and I heard Stravinsky's Rite Of Spring, too.
I started mixing with people with international interests. I lived in Heliopolis, a suburb of Cairo. We got together many times to experiment with music and ideas at the YMCA. The YMCA was an intellectual center for concerts, philosophy, different ideas, sports, meetings, for everything. I experimented with a lot of my music there. I played some of my compositions in art exhibits at the YMCA and at other institutions of art. They had a chamber for me in the art studio. People walked in and listened to my music as part of the exhibit. They did that for The Expression Of The Zaar and It Is Dark And Damp On The Front. Whatever music I had, they exhibited it. So I had a lot of recognition and support when I was growing up.
I started taking formal lessons at the age of 15, and I continued to do that at the Schulz Conservatory. I got involved with other practical conservatories like the Tiegerman and Hickmann Conservatories. Hickmann was interested in ancient Egypt, so I used to frequent his conservatory. Hickmann was trying  to compare the clarinet to an ancient reed instrument. He thought clarinet originated in Egypt, and he brought examples of the clarinet and bassoon to the conservatory. It was very interesting.
I also frequented the Institute of Arabic music in Cairo, a huge institute. They had a piano with a 24 tone scale. In fact, I played that instrument with one of my compositions at the United Nations. It was done with a Syrian woman who created a grand piano like the one in Cairo with 24 pitches to the octave and terraced keyboards.
I experimented with piano, drums, with the voice, my voice and other voices. Especially the voice was a main thing. The voice attracted me a lot.

5 - How was it to work at the famous Columbia-Princeton Electronic Music Center in the 1950s and how was it to work with Otto Luening and Vladimir Ussachevsky?

HALIM EL-DABH - The story starts back in 1955, 56. I was invited to the MacDowell Colony in Petersboro, New Hampshire. I had a cottage there with a piano. The MacDowell Colony brings composers and artists to the settlement, leaves them alone and does everything they need. During the time I was there, the library had a grand piano so I used to go there and lock the door and change everything. I took wires, connected them to the piano wires on the instrument, tied them up and bottled them in the wall. I wanted to get a great variety of string sounds, and I wrote Symphonies In Sonic Vibrations during this period. Who walks into this library which I transformed? Both Luening and Ussachevsky. They looked and exclaimed, "What are you doing here?" The minute they saw what I was doing they said, "This guy should come to Columbia University with us".
After I finished MacDowell Colony I was invited to Columbia University with a grant to use their studio and work there. As the years went by, Luening and I collaborated on several compositions like Electronic Fanfarre and Diffusion Of Bells. So we collaborated using machinery and RCA electronic recorder that they put there. I was invited, and then I became a member of the Columbia-Princeton Electronic Music Center. So after that visit they saw me, what I was doing, and dragged me to Columbia University. They saw how I was dealing with sound and sound vibration.

6 - Can you talk more about the RCA sound synthesizer?

HALIM EL-DABH - The synthesizer was an innovation that gave us a larger expansion of sound manipulation. We used punch cards to input and receive sound from the machine. It took up a whole wall, it was huge. We were able to get very clear sounds of whatever we synthesized whether it was trumpet, violin or any other sound. I especially liked to input my voice. Luening did an input of his piccolo to transform it. I did an input of my drum to transform it and then took the sounds back from the synthesizer. The members of the Music Center made a pact not to imitate or recreate the actual instrument sounds, since we understood those sounds could put live musicians out of work.
The synthesizer has to do with mathematical manipulation of sound. Babbitt was involved much with it because he is more mathematical in his thoughts. Babbitt most wanted to work with the synthesizer, but I worked with it by taking the sounds and further manipulating them through a series of Ampex recorders in the studio. With ten Ampex machines, their remote controls and speaker rods outside the room in the hallways, I ran tapes from the Ampex recorders out into the hallway in a looping form. I had quite a number of loops, and as they played I recorded what I wanted from the loops. It was something. I had loops all the way down the hallway, spreading out before me and then coming back to me. With the remote controls and all these loops, I danced! It was fabulous! I said, "Wow!"
These loops would come and go, and I ended up with the recorded result. I took the resultant recording and played it again. I called the process "generation", because the first generation is kind of crude. When you do this you must work through generation after generation. I tracked the tapes from one generation on the wall. I lined them up in groups by various generations until the whole wall would be covered with generations of tape. I could come to the wall and pick up from them as I wanted to and mix them again. By the time I came to four or five generations of interaction I began to feel comfortable. In the first generation, you could hear the raw sound of the instrument; to finish you have to go deep into the sound. You really have to go deeply into it.
I was glad to be invited by the trombonist George Lewis to see the old Ampex recording suite in about 2005. After working with the Ampex machines, the Columbia-Princeton Music Center had Moog synthesizers, but I never used them. I used the RCA to some extent, but never without extensive manipulation of the resulting sounds. I mostly relied on my own filtering and alterations of sound recordings, especially voltage changes. I also did a lot with white sound. White sound has enormous possibilities because everything is in there.

7 - You've traveled to Brazil in the 1970s and the early 80s, right? What are your memories of those trips?

HALIM EL-DABH - I planned to travel to Brazil in the 1970s, but I actually traveled to Salvador, Bahia, in 1982 and '83. I was there to research some of the Afro-Brazilian music and so I was involved with the candomblé ceremony. I got to know many people and was able to participate in various candomblé rituals. Some of the rituals were in areas that reverence Ogun, and in the mountains of Petropolis there was Exu. In Bahia there was Shango. One of the terreiros, the high places, had the Preto Velho sitting by to talk to. The Preto Velho was the old, wise black man. They called me Shango Kao. I'm not certain of the meaning of Kao. Maybe the people were calling me Shango of the East because I was struck by lightening and Shango is the God who is supposed to do that.
I had a really great time and visited the island of Itaparica where I got the witness the Egunguns' ceremony. That was an incredible experience.
Basically, all the time I spent in Bahia, Petropolis, Itaparica and Rio de Janeiro I played music with the people. I played with the percussionist Djalma Correa. I played at the Sala Cecilia Meireles with him and several other musicians in Rio to a packed house. I played piano and they played percussion and clarinet. It was a great experience. I never slept during the Carnaval. I attended every event and traveled from Rio de Janeiro to Bahia to see Carnaval there.
I had a full and rich experience of Afro-Brazilian culture, ceremonies and music. I participated a lot in the music part of Brazil when I was there. I received a very generous and kind reception from the people I met. They made it wonderful for me to carry on research.
I had contact with an parliamentarian named Nascimento and his American wife. He was part of the tradition I was studying. I also had contact with the University of Brazil at Salvador. I talked there about the retention of Yoruba culture in Brazil and its relationship to Egyptian culture. I was very involved with scholars in the university at Rio de Janeiro, so I had very full and active life in Brazil.

8 - What are you doing nowadays, and what are your plans for the future?

HALIM EL-DABH - I'm energized that there is excitement about electronic music. Having done electronic music on the frontier of the field with Ta'abir al-Zaar, I am still searching for new ways to transform sound and to utilize electronic music. In 2001, I completed a work called Signals And Connections for the American Music Center in New York. That's a crazy piece. You hear it on the phone when you call up the American Music Center.
Right now I want to explore more the sound of the human voice. I've always been interested in the range and power of the human voice, the elements within it really have no end. I'm still interested in the voice and how its transformation has an effect on us, as a creative work and as an art form. I'm just settling down to get my equipment back into shape.
All sounds still fascinate to me, from the sounds of cicadas and beetles to everyday noise. More that ever I want to work with the sounds of humans, of nature and of everything around me to communicate and share with the world.

Photo: James Vaughan
Photo: Christo
Update: Halim El-Dabh, Deborah El-Dabh and Astronauta Pinguim in Kent, OH (USA), on July 28th, 2014 (photo by Laurel Myers Hurst):


Visit Halim El-Dabh's website: www.halimeldabh.com


Friday, November 01, 2013

Seven questions to Rick Wakeman


Richard Christopher Wakeman - yes, Rick Wakeman - was born on May 18th 1949 in Perivale - a suburb in west London, England -, to bring joy and happiness to Cyril Frank Wakeman and Mildred Helen Wakeman, his parents. Young Rick started playing the piano at the age of 5, attended Clarinet lessons and formed a tradicional jazz band at 12, commenced Church organ lessons at 13 and joined a blues band called The Atlantic Blues at 14. In 1966 he bought his first car (one of his passions) and also played his first BBC sessions with the James Royal Set for Radio One (with The Who's John Entwhistle on bass guitar). In 1968, Rick secured a place at the Royal College of Music, studying piano, modern music, clarinet and orchestration for one year, leaving the college in favor of his work as a session musician.

In June 1969, Rick Wakeman recorded a Mellotron on David Bowie's "Space Oddity" (released in July 1969) and also recorded piano on the first Strawbs album, "Dragonfly", joining the band in the next year. In July 1970 the Strawbs recorded their second album, "Just A Collection Of Antiques And Curios - Live At The Queen Elizabeth Hall". The concert that originated the album was one of the first events in Rick's life that brought him the attention of the media (Melody Maker mentioned him as the "Tomorrow's Superstar"), increasing his demand for session work with other artists. In 1971 Rick recorded Strawbs' third album, "From The Witchwood" but left the band right after the album was ready. Also in 1971, Rick purchased his first Minimoog, previously owned by actor Jack Wild, who didn't know that the synthesizer was monophonic and, thinking that it was broken, sold it to Rick for half the price it originally costed. In 1971 Rick Wakeman recorded with Cat Stevens ("Morning Has Broken"), David Bowie ("Life On Mars?", "Changes" and "Oh! You Pretty Things", among others from Bowie's "Hunky Dory" album) and Lou Reed (on his debut solo album, "Lou Reed", released in April 1972).

Of course by that time Rick Wakeman was already a very well-known musician, but his life and popularity would change after a phone call he received from a certain Chris Squire, from a certain band called Yes. Rick said Yes to Yes and in August 1971 Jon Anderson, Chris Squire, Bill Bruford and Steve Howe had a new keyboard player in their band. Not only a keyboard player but THE keyboard player. Rick Wakeman brought to the band the certain elements that they needed to continue their search for the perfect, orchestrated progressive rock. The band released the album "Fragile" in November 1971 and Rick Wakeman toured the United States Of America for the first time with his new friends. And naturally, being a Yes member brought more attention to Rick and he signed a solo recording contract with A&M Records in the end of 1971.

In 1972, Rick Wakeman recorded his first solo album, "The Six Wives Of Henry VIII", parallel to the concerts and tours with Yes, the recording of "Close To The Edge" - the band's fifth album (the second with Rick), released in September 1972 -, and the recording of "Yessongs", a triple live album and film from their 1972 concerts. Also in 1972, Oliver Wakeman, his first son, was born.

"The Six Wives Of Henry VIII" was released in January 1973 and Yes' "Yessongs" was released in March 1973. In the second half of the year, Yes went to studio to record their sixth studio album, the  conceptual double LP "Tales From The Topographic Oceans", released in December 1973. The album was controversial, even inside the band, and it is known that Rick didn't like the result, so he left the band right after the album's tour. And yes, also in 1973, Rick Wakeman found some free time to record with Black Sabbath on their "Sabbath Bloody Sabbath" album!

The second of two concerts realized on January 18th 1974 resulted on the recording of "Journey To The Center Of The Earth", not only the second Rick Wakeman solo album and not only his most famous and best-seller album, but also one of the most famous LPs from the golden age of progressive rock. Personally, almost everyone I know in this world has (or had at some point) this album. And it couldn't be different, the mixture of the London Symphony Orchestra, the English Chamber Choir, a nice rock band, two vocalists singing lyrics based on Julio Verne's novel, Moog synthezisers, Mellotrons, piano, electric piano, clavinet, Hammond organ, and the famous silver cape, all inside a nice and colored cover and booklet, "Journey To The Center Of The Earth" caught almost every rock fan, all around the world. Adam Wakeman, Rick's second son, was born on March 1974.

After a performance of "Journey To The Center Of The Earth" at the Crystal Palace Bowl, Rick Wakeman collapsed after the concert, entering the Wexham Park Hospital with a suspected minor heart attack. During the weeks he stayed at the hospital, he wrote his third solo album, "The Myths And Legends Of King Arthur And The Riders Of The Round Table", recorded in late 1974 and early 1975 and released in April 1975. Even with the recent hospital event, Rick toured around the world in 1975, playing in Japan, Australian and, for the first time, in Brazil (on September 1975. Unfortunately I was born a few weeks after his brazilian concerts, so I wasn't able to attend). Also in 1975 the soundtrack for the movie "Lisztomania" was released (on November, with Frank Liszt pieces and other music played by Rick Wakeman, who also appeared on the screen) and Rick almost bankrupted, losing lots of money on the production of an extravagant concert that mixed King Arthur and ice skating at the Wembley Empire Pool. On May 1976 the album "No Earthly Connection" was released and in November Rick Wakeman decided to rejoin Yes, moving to Switzerland for some months since the band was there to record their new album, "Going For The One". The recording process was filmed almost in full and there are some hours of the recording sessions available on Youtube. "Going For The One" was released on July 1977, the same year that Rick released his solo albums "White Rock" and "Criminal Record". "Tormato", Yes' ninth studio album, was released in 1978, with Rick Wakeman leaving the band for the second time, again after the subsequent tour, in the next year (by the way, Jon Anderson left the band also in this occasion). Benjamin Wakeman, his third son, was born in 1978. Rick Wakeman released the double album "Rhapsodies" on May 1979.

Throughout the eighties, Rick Wakeman continued to release very good albums (the soundtrack for the movie "The Burning" and the concept album based on George Orwell's novel "1984", both released in 1981 being the best examples, in my opinion), evolving himself more and more with football (also one of his passions - he became the director of the Brentford Football Club in 1979 and chairman of the Camberley Town Football Club in 1983, and also recorded the soundtrack for the official documentary film on the 1982 FIFA World Cup in Spain), divorced and married two times during the decade, had his first daughter, Jemma Wakeman (born on February 1983), became a golf enthusiast, had his fifth kid, Oscar Wakeman (born in 1986), and rejoined his Yes bandmates in the 'almost Yes' band/project Anderson, Bruford, Wakeman and Howe, in 1989. In the ninties he rejoined Yes again (in 1990, when ABWH and then Chris Squire's Yes merged in one big band to record the album "Union"), left Yes again, rejoined Yes again (in 1996 to the album "Keys To Ascension", but left again before the subsequent tour), released solo albums, recorded and toured with his son Adam Wakeman, wrote his autobiography ("Say Yes!", first published in 1995), and recorded a sequence for "Journey To The Center Of The Earth" called "Return To The Center Of The Earth" (released in 1999). In 2000 a live DVD was recorded in Argentina ("Live In Buenos Aires", released in 2001). In 2004 Rick divorces from his third wife, Nina Carter, and also talks for the first time about Amanda Wakeman, his american daughter, born in 1986. In 2003 he appeared for the first time on the TV-show Grumpy Old Men, broadcasted on BBC. After the success of Grumpy Old Men, Rick Wakeman became a constant figure in various other TV programs in England, and released two books full of funny stories (he's a very good writer and storyteller!): "Grumpy Old Rockstar and other wondrous stories" (2008) and "Further adventures of a Grumpy Old Rockstar" (2010).

I don't remember exactly when and how it was my first contact with Rick Wakeman's music, but I was very very young, because I remember that I wanted to be "like Rick Wakeman" in my childhood and teenage days, discovering that I wanted to be a musician and play that instrument that I've read in many album covers: the Moog synthesizer! But my contact with Rick to this interview was via Wayne Smith, the webmaster of Rick's official website. Wayne was nice in replying me right after he received my invitation and told me to send the questions to the interview, so Rick would reply me with the answers as soon as he could. In a few days I received a nice email, with Rick's answers and that's it: I interviewed one of my childhood superheroes, Mr. Rick Wakeman!


ASTRONAUTA - Rick, what were your earliest influences in popular and classical music?

RICK - Having started my classical training at the age of 5 and radio being very limited in England in the 1950's, it was not easy to hear popular music except on the occasional pop music programme on the radio. By the late fifties popular music has started to appear on television and I was fascinated with skiffle and Lonnie Donegan in particular, who became a great friend in later life. I think like all young musicians, you were influenced by all sorts of music but whilst I have favourites I never wanted to copy or be like anyone else.

As I got older my classical love was nearly all eastern. Prokofiev being my main hero.

ASTRONAUTA - When and how did you meet Robert Moog for the first  time and what are you memories about Bob Moog?

RICK - I met Bob for the first time in 1971 and we remained great friends right up until his death. He changed history for keyboard players and literally all forms of music from rock to film. He was extremely modest, loved musicians and had time for everybody. Without him, music would have a very different sound today.

ASTRONAUTA - How many Minimoog model D synthesizers did you have during all your career and how many of those Minimoogs do you still have? Can you tell us a little bit about the history of your Minimoogs?

RICK - I don't know the exact answer, but I think I have probably owned about 20 Minimoogs in my lifetime. I currently have 9. Finding good ones is extremely difficult. I have a very good man who repairs them for me and keeps them in good order. I cannot even imagine not having one. I have bought them for many different countries, and one from Switzerland which amazingly I used to own back in the early seventies!

ASTRONAUTA - And how about Mellotrons? Do you still have a Mellotron (or a Birotron)?

RICK - No... I use a Memotron now which is just sensational. It does everything a Mellotron used to do without all the problems!

ASTRONAUTA  - In 1975 you came to Brazil for the first time, being the first prog-rock superstar - let me use the word 'superstar', if you don't mind - to play in Brazil. What are your memories from those concerts in Brazil?

RICK - The most memorable and fantastic times. I fell in love with Brazil the day I arrived and that love for the country and the people has never wavered. A great source of inspiration. We played Journey To The Center Of The Earth on that tour and it is my hope that we will be back again playing it very soon.

ASTRONAUTA - What are your favorite album and song from Yes?

RICK - Favourite albums... Fragile... Close To The Edge... And favourite track, Awaken from Going For The One.

ASTRONAUTA - And how about your solo albums, if you'd have to choose a preferred one, which one would be?

RICK - The answer would change every day!!!... But probably the new 55 minute studio version of Journey To The Center Of The Earth.